#59 - How to Be Better At Talking On the Phone

Welcome to the Talk to People Podcast.

We are going to start with a little ukulele lick.

Shout out to Theo Vaughan with Bishop Gunn.

Shine your light on me.

Today, we have one person turning into our live stream and Carson Kidd.

And the topic of this podcast is how to be better on the phone.

So we're going to start by calling the one person who's on our live stream.

Welcome to the Talk to People Podcast.

Man, I feel like I should restart.

This is already feeling clunky, but I'm going for it.

So Carson hopped on my live Instagram live stream.

I tried to live stream and record a podcast at the same time, but it was super hard.

And that's totally new for me, but I'm glad I tried.

Let's see what he's doing.

What's he doing?

Hey, you are actively on the Talk to People Podcast.

Yeah.

So you're my only livestream person.

It's so hard recording the livestream and trying to actively record a podcast.

I may have to do them separately or just not give the livestream any attention.

Yeah, I mean, that sounds like, that sounds like it'd be real tough.

That's a big undertaking.

So this episode is about how to be better at talking on the phone.

And we talk on the phone pretty often.

So I was curious what you think a good phone call consists of.

A good phone call or a fun phone call?

A good phone call.

Well, I would say a good phone call consists of just, I guess, a reason for the phone call.

So a purpose of the conversation.

Some good banter, maybe.

A little back and forth, a little small talk.

How you doing?

How's the wife?

You know, maybe then you'd jump into something a little more serious, get into the nitty gritty, address why the phone call is made.

And then, you know, some nice formalities there.

And, you know, I know you've talked before in your podcast about how to take leave.

What's your favorite?

What's your favorite way to take leave?

On a phone call?

Probably just, like, pinning an excuse on someone else that they can't really track down.

Like, oh, man, I think my wife's calling my name.

I better get going.

Because that's pretty safe.

How often do you talk on the phone with friends in a normal week?

I would probably say pretty low.

I'm not a big phone call guy, but, like, you know, obviously with friends like you, where we live in different states, it's kind of a necessity.

But I would say less than 30 minutes a week.

That's, I wonder what the average is.

I'm going to call a few other people, and I'm going to see what the average is.

What's the average?

And then, last question, what not to do on a phone call?

Don't chew gum.

Don't chew gum.

Don't be smacking food.

Don't be smacking food.

So don't actively be eating while you're talking.

Yeah, I mean, I personally don't love that.

And then real quick, before we go, my beautiful wife, Natalie, says that she has something she'd like to add to the conversation.

Let's get it.

Hey, Natalie, you're on the podcast.

I know, I'm so honored, honestly.

You know, something I was thinking of, because I do talk on the phone regularly with people.

And if it's not just a quick, like, informational phone call, I think it's really important to make sure you have enough time.

Because I think that allots for, like, a lot of freedom in flowing with conversation.

But if you're trying to have, like, a meaningful catch up with someone, and you're like, oh, I only have seven minutes, it can, like, not be as intentional.

So, yay or nay on cold calls?

Ooh, I'm a hard no.

I'm a yay.

We got a house divided.

Well, we're gonna talk about that.

I cold call him frequently.

Yeah.

I like a heads up because then I can start.

I'm a guy that likes to prepare and, you know, get my ducks in a row.

So I definitely appreciate the heads up.

Natalie.

I'm a, you can give me a call whenever, but if I can't take it, I'm not gonna answer it.

Right.

Or I'll answer, be like, hey, is everything good?

Like, I've just got a couple minutes, what's up?

And if they're like, oh, I really wanted to catch up.

And I'm like, okay, well, call me back a bit later.

Yeah.

You're like, I'll hit you back.

Okay, well, who should I call next?

Um, you know, I feel like, I feel like Joel Adraboudi would have some good insights.

Who's really good at talking on the phone?

And now that you've already said Joel, if you don't say his name, it's like he's not good.

But with that being said, who's really good at talking on the phone that we both know?

That we both know?

Yeah.

Man, we kind of hang out with a bunch of no phone callers, a bunch of text.

You know, we'll pretend that Joel is the answer to both.

So I'll give him a call real quick.

Okay, sounds good.

Love you guys.

Okay.

Bye.

Bye.

So let's quickly recap what they said.

They said, we'll start with Natalie.

She said, cold calls.

Yes.

I'm going to keep it tally one for cold calls.

One for no cold calls.

Carson said no on cold calls.

Carson said don't chew food.

And then Natalie said, Don't call if you don't have the time.

Carson said have a purpose for the call.

Watching.

All right, let's give Joel a ring.

Let's see if he agrees or disagrees with what we have so far.

We're doing a little data collection here.

No.

You know, despite me being all about communication, I still get nervous when I hear the dumb tone.

Your call has been forwarded to voicemail.

The person you're trying to reach is not available.

At the tone, please record your message.

When you have finished recording, you may hang up.

Hey, Joel, this is Chris, and I'm recording a podcast about how to be better at talking on the phone.

And someone suggested I talk to you.

So if you get this message, call.

I'll probably be recording for the next 20 minutes.

All right, bye.

Okay, someone who I really love talking to was one of my best friends in high school.

He's still a good friend of mine, but we live very far.

Gabe Crowe, he lives in Hawaii.

Let me give him a call.

Not playing, by the way.

These are all cold calls.

Your call has been forwarded to voicemail.

The person you're trying to reach is not available.

At the tone, please record your message.

When you have finished recording, you may hang up.

Hey, Gabe.

I'm actively recording a podcast about how to be better on the phone.

And you're one of my favorite people to talk on the phone with.

Maybe that's just because we plan, so we have a lot of time to really explore.

Oh, Joel's calling me back.

But if you get time in the next 20 minutes, give me a call back.

All right, bye.

Hey, you're on the podcast.

Oh, hey, how's it going?

You're talking to the hundreds, the tens and tens of people right now.

Yeah, so I was, the whole episode is about how to be better on the phone.

Okay.

Very nice.

And I was talking to, Carson Kidd was on my live stream, so I called him, and I said, who should I call next?

And they said, Joel Edgemoody.

So are you with your wife right now?

Yeah, we're just eating dinner.

And I'm with Kat and Brie.

Okay, can I quickly ask you all like three questions?

Yeah, for sure.

Do you want me to put this on speaker?

How do you want me to do this?

Yeah, yeah, put it on speaker.

Okay, one second.

All right, so this is Chris Miller.

We're on his podcast live right now, and he has some questions to ask us.

We're actively recording, okay.

And this episode is about how to be better at phone calls.

Okay, okay, so the first question is cold calls, yay or nay?

Oh, a hundred percent nay.

I'm kind of, because I know me and you will cold call each other sometimes.

It's kind of fun.

The majority of the time, like, it depends on who, maybe.

Sometimes, like, you know, people have a life, and they're working, and they're doing all these things.

And then sometimes it feels a little intrusive.

So but if there's someone you genuinely like to have, like to talk to and have conversations with, it's just so easy to have, like, a, you know, a cold call.

Because I'm like, I don't know if you have me and you ever scheduled a phone call?

Not often.

Yeah, yeah, we really don't.

But, uh, Cat, how would you answer that question?

So I'm putting you down as no, by the way.

Okay, Cat, what did you say?

I would say no.

If you cold call me, I'm probably not going to answer my phone.

Unless you're my family.

All right, Brie, cold calls, yay or nay?

Um, I'm going to go with, uh, yay.

All right.

But it's got to be from someone that I enjoy talking to.

Question two.

One thing that people who are really good at talking on the phone do?

One thing people talking on the phone do, I think they're curious about what the other person has to say.

Um, but then at the same time, phone calls are always one of those things that you can kind of just speak your mind at the same time.

And so, like, when I'm on a phone call with you, we kind of just spitball back and forth, and we'll ask questions, uh, continuing the conversation, like, adding to other people's ideas.

So, I think conversations are really great when it's like, you're not just saying things, and the other person's just kind of, like, not saying anything back, or it's like, even if you don't even know anything about the topic, it's always nice to have someone, like, asking a question about the topic, so that they're a little bit more engaged, you know?

Be curious.

Be curious.

What about you, Cat?

Um, I would say people who are, like, low stakes.

So, they're calling you not because they meet, like, it's, they're calling you just to kind of invite you into a conversation, and they feel really casual about it.

I have a friend that really invites me into conversation.

She'll go, hey, I'm just calling you because I'm driving in the car, and honestly, I just want to be on the phone with someone.

And then I'm like, okay, so I don't owe you anything.

Phone call.

It's pretty easy to actually just say whatever or not, like, really talk during it.

That's good.

That's pretty good.

The question is, what do people who are good at phone calls do, essentially?

I think people who are good at phone calls lead the conversation really well.

So they're asking good questions.

They're engaging in your communication and maybe adding points to it, but they're leading the call really well.

Nice.

All right.

Curious, catch up and lead the call.

Well, okay, last question.

And this is a rapid fire.

What not to do on the phone?

Say nothing.

Just go, mm-hmm, mm-hmm, yep, mm-hmm.

Because your phone call is probably going to die in less than three minutes.

Cat, what about you?

I'd say have conversations that don't actually matter.

I'm just like, I just kind of want to be off the phone and watching my TV show.

Do not eat.

That was the thing that Carson said, which is funny.

And it's one thing that's funny is both Carson and Natalie, our house divided on cold calls.

Natalie's like, yes, cold calls.

Carson's like, I want to plan.

Yeah, that guy lives his whole life on a plan.

OK, thanks, you all.

You'll be able to hear yourself on the podcast, but I'm going to call my mom now.

I love you guys.

OK, let's recap real quick.

Cold calls, we have two for cold calls, three against cold calls.

They said people who are really good at phone calls are curious, so they're looking into things.

They.

Call without like a big.

It's almost like, hey, I want to spend the time to catch up with you, right?

As Cat said, inviting you into conversation.

And then Bree said they lead the convo well.

What not to do on phone call, don't say nothing.

Don't have conversations that don't matter because Cat wants to get back to TV and do not be eating on the phone.

We've heard that twice.

All right, one of my favorite people to talk to on the phone is my mom.

We'll see if she's up and at him.

Hello?

Hey, I'm actively recording a podcast, so you're on the podcast right now.

Yes, and the purpose of the episode is how to be better at talking on the phone.

So I'm calling some of my favorite people to talk to you on the phone, and you're one of them.

I have three quick questions, okay, that I've asked everybody, and I want to get your opinion.

So people who are really good at talking on the phone that you know, what is something that they do?

They get to the point, and they listen to me talk, and they are just, you know, good at explaining what they called me for.

What about what not to do on a phone call?

I guess you need to, well, I always ask the person if they have time to talk, and that way I am relaxed.

If they have time to talk, I'm relaxed to speak, say what I called for.

And then if they don't have time, I can just call them later.

That's really good.

What about this?

Called calls, yay or nay?

Calling people without planning.

Well, sometimes yes.

Sometimes I feel it's more personal to the point, especially when you're asking a person if they want to do something with you.

I feel like it's so easy for, if you text, it's so easy for that person to say no.

But if you call, then you can talk about it and put your feelings into it.

I love that.

And I love you.

And thanks for...

Now I'm going to...

I've called a few different people, and now I think I'm gonna tally up everything that everybody said.

And it's funny, I've asked six different people, and three people said, yay for cold calls, and three people said no for cold calls.

Yeah, so the tally is split, but you want to hear some of the things people said not to do?

They said, don't chew food while you're talking, don't call if you don't have time, don't say nothing, don't have a convo, that doesn't matter, do not eat.

And people said that people who are really good at phone calls are curious, they are upfront about what they're calling about, they lead the convo well, they get to the point, they listen, they ask the other person if they have time to talk, and they have purpose for the call.

Pretty good assessment, huh?

Yeah, I agree.

Well, now this is your second time to talk on the podcast.

And then I talked to Annie, and I'll call you tomorrow to plan the trip to Lawrence.

All right.

Sleep tight.

Love you too.

All right.

Hey, if you haven't listened to her podcast episode, it is so good.

She has been an absolute warrior and is one of my favorite people in the world.

I think I've played a little ukulele whenever she's been around, but I should learn a ukulele song.

That way I could just play for her.

She would probably like Somewhere Over the Rainbow.

What about this?

The US.

We are very grateful for the support of the US.

Department of State.

Department of State.

Department of State.

We are very grateful for the support So, there's a ton of other people I could call, because I talk to a lot of different people throughout the week.

That's something, oh man, I have to call one person.

So far, I've had four guys, or two guys and four ladies weigh in, so we're doing International Women's Month right.

Chris Coe, do you have a real quick second?

So I'm actually recording a podcast right now about how to have better phone calls, and I feel like you are good at it, so I wanted to ask you three quick questions.

So cold calls, yay or nay?

With friendships.

Yay.

Yay, and what's your reasoning there?

Because I always find that like a surprise phone call from someone always makes my day.

Yeah, right, me too.

Okay, and then people who are really good at phone calls, what do they do?

They definitely ask questions about you, and they're good listeners.

What about what not to do on the phone?

I think it's easy when we get caught up, especially with friendships, to like, if we're in a specific story.

I fall short of this sometimes too, that like I could easily talk about my situation.

And instead again, like maybe being a better listener, and also, you know, navigating the conversation and be like, how's everything going on with your life, or what's up, or tell me more about that.

Right.

So you could just keep talking about what you got going on, but not like turn the tables.

Yeah, that's something I always need to navigate better.

I feel that.

Okay, so last time you're on the podcast, what was it like episode 37?

I think so.

So the listeners want to know how you're doing since then.

How am I doing?

I'm doing good.

I had a really good week.

It was my birthday week, 29.

So one more year till 30, but I had, I've been good.

Life's been moving and grooving.

That's why I keep telling people.

All healthy, all good.

I don't know.

29, feeling fine?

Yeah.

I'm only a couple days in, but I'm ready to rock.

You know, I turned 29 in about two months.

That's right.

Yeah, May the 4th be with you.

All of the people I've called, so I've talked to six, you're my seventh person I've talked to right now.

And I was like, okay, you are so good at talking on the phone.

The other three people, they had like, one person hopped on the live stream, and another person was like, hey, call this person, then call this person.

So then I started playing the ukulele, and I was like, okay, I have to call Chris Go.

But four people said yay for cold calls.

Three people said nay for cold calls.

What not to do on the phone is don't chew food, don't call if you don't have the time, don't say nothing, don't have convos that don't matter.

And then what to do is be curious, invite people into conversation, lead the convo well, get to the point, listen, ask if they have time to talk, have a purpose for the call, and ask questions.

Pretty good.

There's way better answers than what I gave, I think.

No, you gave great questions.

Okay, so now I'm gonna do like five minutes with me and the camera, and then I'm gonna be done.

All right, thank you, Crisco, you rock.

I know, hopefully it sounds good.

Like, I had the phone up to the microphone, so I have to figure out.

Is this your first time doing this?

I had one wherever I played things, but this is my first time talking to people on the phone.

So, like, last episode was my first time where I played ukulele on the podcast, and this is the first time where I'm having a lot of firsts.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

Okay, I'll talk to you soon.

You know what's funny is I'm really, it's like a natural thing to say, I love you at the end of phone calls.

And I know Annie, my wife, she kind of jokes how that's one of her fears is to get off a phone call and be like, all right, love you.

Whenever it's like a coworker or something.

But a lot of these people in life, I do genuinely love.

So all of my friends, Chris being one of them, I definitely love them.

So ending phone calls with love you, I think is also a really good practice.

I know I didn't just do it there.

I did it with my mom.

I don't think I did it with Joel and Kat and Bree.

I did it with Carson and Natalie.

But all of them, I have love for them.

So saying love you at the end can be fun.

One of my friends, Tonio, he's really good at that.

Whenever he's holding on the phone, he's like, I love you.

And it's like, oh, that's sweet.

A couple of things people haven't mentioned that I want to make sure I mentioned before we end this podcast.

One is our phones are so awesome.

I love our phones.

I have an iPhone 12 mini and it's doing well.

It's hanging out.

But one of the downsides of having an iPhone 12 mini is that you have access to everything, to TikTok, to Facebook, to Instagram, to YouTube.

And I think that it's so easy to be on the phone and be scrolling something else.

And I'm guilty of this.

And whenever I am, my better self, I'm very intentional about not doing that.

Like, nope.

So don't scroll.

If you actually want to have good conversations on the phone, don't scroll.

We trick ourselves into thinking like, oh, hey, we're going to be...

The other person's not going to notice.

And we may not even think the other person's not going to notice.

Like, maybe we're not even thinking about that.

But we think to ourselves, I can do both.

And realistically, technically you can.

It's just like I can livestream, record a podcast, and talk on the phone all at the same time.

But the vibe's going to be different if I'm just sitting here talking to this camera.

So whenever you are talking on the phone, don't do that.

Don't get on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, any of that jazz.

Another thing is when you're talking on the phone, smile.

I guess there were moments where I know I was taking breaths whenever the dial tone was happening because that's a little...

It's uncertainty, right?

It's just like the blinking cursor on the computer.

The blinking cursor in grad school was the worst thing because you needed to write a thesis, but you had to deal with the blinking cursor.

If you could get past the blinking cursor and actually put words on paper, you could get somewhere, but the dial tone, it's ah!

And things that we can do to be better at talking on the phone is smiling.

Our body language, even when it's just us by ourselves, our body language affects our mood.

It affects our paravocalics.

It affects how we sound.

It affects our confidence.

I talk a lot about Amy Cuddy.

She used to be a social behavioral psychologist at Harvard, and she has the second most popular TED Talk.

And she talks about power poses, how if we stand in big, open poses, that it reduces our levels of cortisone and it improves our...

what reduces our stress hormone.

And I think it raises testosterone.

I forget that part.

But I know it reduces stress, and it makes us feel a little bit more...

our self-efficacy is a little higher.

We feel like we're a little bit more capable of things.

There was a few studies that initially her TED talk, she said, if you do a power pose in the bathroom before your interview, you're going to be less stressed and you're going to feel more capable in the interview.

There were studies done that showed after power pose, there was no traceable effect.

But during the power pose, there was.

So that being said, if you smile when you're on the phone, you're going to do better.

If you smile while you're recording a podcast, you're going to feel better.

So don't scroll.

Don't be looking at videos.

Smile while you're talking on the phone.

And feel free to get up and walk.

Movement is really cool.

And one of my goals for 2024 is to do a walk and talk podcast.

Because when we think of conversation, oftentimes we think of sitting down and sitting next to one another on a park bench or sitting in another bound chairs at a mahogany style study with a fireplace.

But walking and talking is really good.

And I think it is really good for multiple reasons.

It keeps us active, keeps us moving.

And whenever we get to look down the path, you may feel comfortable saying something that you may not, when you're looking down the, like at the bridge of my glasses, right?

So smile, get to the point.

I'm going to do a quick recap.

Smile while you're talking on the phone.

Get to the point.

Whenever you call someone, hey, do you have a quick second?

Or, hey man, I was just thinking about you.

Or, hey, could I ask you for some quick advice?

Open the conversation with the point.

As soon as they say hello, the ball's in your court.

Multiple people have said, don't chew food.

Have a purpose for the call.

If it's just to hang out and spend time together, let them know that.

And then listen and ask questions.

I love all of this.

There were so many more people that I could call and that I talked to regularly on the phone.

I would, if you have, let me check real quick to make sure it's still up.

But I'm going to be doing voicemails on the podcast and responding to questions or just hearing people out if there's something that they'd like to share.

So if you go to talktopeoplepodcast.com, at the bottom right corner, you're going to see a microphone icon.

If you click that microphone icon, it says, We'd love to hear from you.

Click below to send a voicemail to the podcast.

And if you click Start Recording, it'll say, We'd like to access your microphone.

And you can send a two-minute long voice recording.

So go on the TalkToPeoplePodcast.

I would love for you to send in voicemails.

Check it in with me.

Let me know how you're doing.

Let me know if there's anything that has really fascinated you lately about communication or something you've been struggling with that you want to improve at.

And in the next few episodes, we can look at some of those voicemails.

Theo Vaughn, the comedian and the podcaster, is so good at this.

And it's created a community, and I'd like to do the same.

It's going to be a different community than Theo Vaughn.

But I'm not Theo Vaughn, so that makes sense.

Thank you all for being here.

Let me know what you thought of this episode.

You can always email me at talktopeoplepodcast.gmail.com.

You can follow the podcast Instagram, Talk To People Podcast.

And I'm excited.

I like doing this.

I'm going to try and have this edited and published.

In like 30 minutes, the video version is going on Patreon.

The audio version is going everywhere on the podcast platforms.

If you'd like to join my Patreon community, I'm going to be having, or I do have ad free versions of all my Communication Expert Reacts videos.

I have exclusive content, like stuff like this, but other things as well.

Early access to content I put up, so this is going to go up tonight.

People who aren't part of the Patreon will get the audio version tomorrow.

And then links, and I do live streams and Q&As.

So the bottom tier is five bucks, and you get most of that.

And then it's like 9.18, which is because a 9.18 is from the area code that I grew up on.

Okay, got the cameras on, the lights on, the microphones on.

Well, folks, this was a blast, and I'll see you next time.